2004 Business Meetings

January

January 2004

The doors of the business meeting remain open to all members for the duration of the meeting. If you haven't already done so, please familiarize yourself with the Group Conscience Guidelines, which describe how we conduct GROW business.

Business meetings move along quickly according to a pre-determined timeline. If you are joining a meeting already in progress, please review the summary provided here before posting to the list.

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GROW BUSINESS MEETING: January 4, 2004
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Quarterly Reports

Trusted Servant Status
Filled Positions:
Birthday Listkeeper: Kirsten
Sponsor Listkeeper: Barb S.
Weekly Lead Listkeeper: Kris M.
There are no other trusted servant openings at this time.

Business

1A. OSC Charter: How should our rep vote
1B. Web Site and Funding Proposal (For action in OSC4): Would GROW like to see an OCD web site
2. Online Contributions
3A. Treasurer Minimum Membership
3B. Treasurer Transition Options

GROW Business Meeting MINUTES, JANUARY 3 - 6, 2004 On January 3, 2004, Chair Mage B. opened the business meeting.
The following quarterly reports were posted: Archivist, Greeter, GSR, OIAA, Treasurer, Secretary, Steering Committee Recording Secretary and Listkeeper.
Cheryl T. , Secretary, announced that Kirsten volunteered to fill out the Birthday Listkeeper term vacated by Laurie, and that the positions of Sponsor Listkeeper and Weekly Lead Listkeeper are still open.
Mage, Chair, posted the agenda, as follows, and then opened Agenda Item 1A for discussion.

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GROW BUSINESS MEETING AGENDA: January 2004
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Agenda Items:

1A. OSC Charter: How should our rep vote?
1B. Web Site and Funding Proposal (For action in OSC4): Would GROW like to see an OSC web site
2. Online Contributions
3A. Treasurer Minimum Membership
3B. Treasurer Transition Options

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Item 1A : OSC Charter - DISCUSSION

Gigi, OSC representative for GROW, requested a group conscience on how she should vote on the proposed OSC Charter.

By the end of the first four days, 5 respondents had given a head nod for the proposed charter, with one of the 5, after hearing discussion, stating that she needed to give it more thought. Four respondents voiced concerns, summarized as follows:

1. The majority of reps from 44 groups will issue online advisories that are considered the group conscience (GC) of all online AA. Motions would be approved by two-thirds majority, or as Karen pointed out, 29 random people deciding group conscience for other online groups, including GROW.

2. OSC is a relatively young group and needs to demonstrate maturity before being given such a responsibility.

We are fortunate to have two GROW members involved with OSC. Karen is the representative for another group, and gigi is the representative for GROW. Both have shared helpful insight.

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This completes the minutes for January 3 - 6, 2004
Cheryl T., Secretary

GROW Business Meeting
MINUTES, JANUARY 7 - 10, 2004

Cheryl T. , Secretary, announced that Barb S. has volunteered for the position of Sponsor Listkeeper; and Kris M. has volunteered for Weekly Lead Listkeeper. All open trusted servant positions have been filled for this quarter.

Mage B. Chair, posted an updated agenda, continuing discussion on Item 1A (OSC Charter), and adding items that came to her attention after the business meeting started. Here is revised agenda:

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GROW BUSINESS MEETING AGENDA: Revised January 7, 2004
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1A. OSC Charter: How should our rep vote Continuing the discussion for four more days until 1-9.

1B. Web Site and Funding Proposal (For action in OSC4): Would GROW like to see an OCD web site. Closed. The website is already in place. Funding to be discussed in Agenda item 2.

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Late additions to the agenda.
1C. OSC definition of an online group?
1D. OSC Rep length of term?
1E. Does grow want to be listed on the OSC site?
1F. New OSC pamphlet entitled, "What Is Online AA?" -- Should our rep vote to adopt this?

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2. Online Contributions
3A. Treasurer Minimum Membership
3B. Treasurer Transition Options

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Continued discussion: OSC Charter

The second 4-day discussion on the OSC Charter centered around a proposal that we:
1) continue to send our representative to OSC;
2) oppose the the proposed OSC Charter;
3) withhold any other decisions (and discussions) regarding OSS until the group arrives at a Charter we can support; and that we
4) write a brief statement to this effect for Gigi can share with OSC.

Of the 11 who responded, nine supported the above proposal. Of these nine, one suggested that GROW consider what we want for our group in terms of representation, our contribution to the group conscience of AA as a whole, and online AA in particular. She suggested this as an agenda item at our October 2004 business meeting, which follows OSC-5.

Of the 11 who responded, two had questions and concerns. One voiced doubt that A.A. as a whole would benefit from an additional layer of bureaucracy. A second member questioned what element(s) would be in a Charter that Grow could support; what has caused us to question the effectiveness of OSC; what are the disadvantages of non OSC membership; and what are the advantages OSC membership.

Following more discussion and clarification, all respondents (11) agreed to support the 4-part proposal. Mage reminded us that this was in keeping with two previous group conscience decisions regarding the OSC. She also reinforced that the remaining questions and concerns would be open for discussion at future GROW-BUS meetings.

Gigi, OSC Rep for GROW, submitted to the business list -- for review and comment -- a draft letter to OSC. The letter was revised slightly in response to feedback from GROW-BUS, as as this second 4-day session drew to an end, gigi learned that OSC was about to close the Charter discussion early. She quickly submitted GROW's letter.

In another bit of businesss related to OSC, Mage reminded the group that GROW discussed the OSC Rep term in April 2003 (under Agenda Item 3-OSC REP TERM). At that time, GROW agreed that the OSC guideline for the term of office for OSC Representatives should be two years. This was recorded as a decision by consensus.

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This completes the minutes for January 7 - 10, 2004
Cheryl T., Secretary

GROW Business Meeting
MINUTES, JANUARY 11 - 14, 2004

Mage B., Chair, summarized that as per our head nods on item 1A, decisions on three OSC items -- 1C) OSC definition of an online group; 1D) OSC rep length of term; and 1E) GROW listing on OSC website -- will be withheld until OSC arrives at a Charter we can support.

This is the updated Agenda for the next 4-day session:
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GROW BUSINESS MEETING AGENDA: Revised January 11, 2004
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Agenda item for consideration at this time:
2. Online Contributions (full report posted separately.)

Agenda items to be considered next:
3. Treasurer:
3A. Treasurer Minimum Membership
3b Treasurer Transition Options
(full reports posted separately.)

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DISCUSSION: OIAA Constributions
Karen, Treasurer for GROW reported that In the year 2000, 15 groups contributed to OIAA a total of $2011. GROW's portion was $130. In 2001, eight groups contributed a total of $693; GROW contributed $100 (15%). There were no OIAA Treasurer reports in 2002, but GROW records show that we contributed $287. In 2003 only five groups contributed a total of $696. GROW contributed $307 or 45%. The trend shows fewer groups contributing with GROW increasingly paying a larger percentage of the total.

According to the OIAA November 3, 2003, Treasurers Report, OIAA had a total of $4,813, including contributions from NB17 and GROW. Expenses for the Internet Server, List Server, office expenses are minimal at about $263. Karen proposed either decreasing our contribution to OIAA with a concurrent increase in contribution to GSO, or eliminating our contributions to OIAA and giving all of our excess to GSO.

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Cheryl T. posted a summary from the April 2003, discussion in which we agreed that despite problems within the organization, OIAA is responsible for many good things, including 12-step work and online information. At that time we discussed withdrawing completely or reducing our financial contribution. Ultimately we agreed to re-evaluate the effectiveness of our continued participation and financial support at a future business meeting.

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One member stated she would be comfortable withdrawing support entirely. Another felt that in light of the service OIAA does provide, a reduced amount would be a rational choice. Another questioned whether or not OIAA still serves a purpose. Early in the discussion, that GROW contributes more than its fair share, was the only thing we all seemed to agree on at this point.

Karen and gigi helped clarify the issues by speaking to the services OIAA does provide. In fact, gigi did such a great job of explaining the value of the OIAA website that she changed her own mind : ). Karen's perception of OIAA being about "service" and OSC being about "governance" seemed to strike a chord with members who were having a hard time seeing a distinction between the two. Karen also reminded us that most of the work of OIAA happens behind the scenes on the committee level, and listed these examples of valuable service:

The OIAA website lists online AA meetings with contact information and breaks them into easily browseable categories. The webmaster is conscientious and updates it promptly and frequently.

The Public Information Committee (PIC) answers 60-100 questions/month from the public. Questions range from searches for local meetings to requests to clarify AA traditions.

The 12 Step Committee answers ~100 emails a month from people asking for help. They are a dedicated bunch of people that pride themselves on their work." By the end of the 4-day session, all responding members agreed that GROW should continue to contribute to OIAA, but no more than our fair share. Our Chair summarized the discussion and asked for head nods as follows:

"We have discussed a proposal that we decrease our contribution to OIAA with a concurrent increase in contribution to GSO, or that we eliminate our contributions to OIAA and give all of our excess to GSO. We have agreed this last four-day period that OIAA provides valuable service and we do not want to completely withdraw support at this time. Neither do we want to continue providing more than our fair share of the financial support. Most of us feel that no letter of concern is necessary at this time.

Currently our Treasurer pays all group expenses first, maintains a prudent reserve equal to 6 months expenses and distributes the excess equally to OIAA and to GSO. In keeping with our wish to contribute only our fair share to the support of OIAA, I offer the following change for your consideration.

GROW will contribute 15% of excess funds to OIAA and 85% to the GSO. Might we reach consensus with a head nod in response to the above statement?"

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This completes the minutes for January 11 - 14, 2004.
Cheryl T., Secretary

GROW Business Meeting
MINUTES, JANUARY 15 - 18, 2004

Mage B., Chair, updated the Agenda for the next 4-day session as follows:
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GROW BUSINESS MEETING AGENDA: Updated January 15, 2004
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Agenda item for consideration at this time:
2. Online Contributions
(full report posted separately.)
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Agenda items to be considered next:
3. Treasurer:
3A. Treasurer Minimum Membership
3b Treasurer Transition Options
(full reports posted separately.)

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DISCUSSION: Item 2 OIAA Contribution
The previous four-day session closed with a request from Mage B., Chair, for response to the following consensus statement.
"Currently our Treasurer pays all group expenses first, maintains a prudent reserve equal to 6 months expenses and distributes the excess equally to OIAA and to GSO. In keeping with our wish to contribute only our fair share to the support of OIAA, I offer the following change for your consideration. GROW will contribute 15% of excess funds to OIAA and 85% to the GSO. Might we reach consensus with a head nod in response to the above statement?" Of the 12 members who responded to this statement, 10 nodded in support. Of those 10, one stated she would not oppose sending OIAA a brief courteous note to this effect, and she wants to see the note before it is sent. Another commented that she feels that our OIAA rep should be the one to bring it to the OIAA group.
One member does not support the statement (no specific reason given to the group). One member supports a reduction in the amount GROW contributes, but feels 15% is too drastic. She would support reducing the contribution to 25%.

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DISCUSSION: Item 3A Minimum Membership
Cheryl T. requested this item for discussion. She wrote: The treasurer holds a key position, as well as much of the responsibility for the online existence and credibility of our group. For the protection of GROW, the individual who handles all member contributions, pays all of our bills and maintains all of our financial records should have a history of at least six months as a member of GROW.
Four members responded to this discussion. The first to comment thinks the treasurer should be an active member of GROW with even more time than six months as a member of GROW. All others think that the Treasurer should be a member of GROW for at least one year, and should be an active participant of the group. Gigi further suggested that "a service position of less time duration, such as a 6-month position, performed well, would be evidence of active participation."
No one voice opposition to establishing a minimum membership for the position of Treasurer.

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This completes the minutes for January 15 - 18, 2004.
Cheryl T., Secretary

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GROW Business Meeting
MINUTES, JANUARY 19 - 22, 2004
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Mage B., Chair, updated the Agenda for the next 4-day session as follows:
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GROW BUSINESS MEETING AGENDA: Updated January 19, 2004
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2. Online Contributions
(Karen's full report attached to Agenda Item 2.)
We do not have consensus on the following statement: " GROW will contribute 15% of excess funds to OIAA and 85% to the GSO."
Therefore we will move this item to formal vote. I have asked our secretary to post the voting procedures separately. According to group conscience guidelines any agenda item that has not reached a consensus or a motion in time to complete the procedure, must be tabled to the next scheduled business meeting. Therefore, this item will be held over to our April 2004 business meeting. I will call for a motion now, so we don't have to backtrack when we pick this item up again in April. Do I hear a motion that reflects the collective thoughts of the previous discussion?

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Agenda Item 3A
There has been little discussion on this agenda item. I would like to leave both these items open for discussion and asking for head nods on both agenda items for another four day period. I will be posting the full agenda items separately at the same time this agenda is posted. If we cannot reach a consensus on these two items, they too will be carried over to the next Business Meeting per our group conscience on the matter.
Sincerely:
Mage, Chair

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DISCUSSION: Online Contributions
On 1/19, Cheryl T. offered the following compromise as a motion. GROW will contribute 20% to OIAA and 80% to GSO. Our OIAA Rep will privately let the OIAA Treasurer know that we are reducing our contribution in keeping with our letter of April, 2003.

The motion was seconded by Jean, and from this point on things began to unravel a bit, with confusion over the process. Cheryl T. posted the GROW voting procedures, the Chair called for a head nod, and Annette asked Cheryl T., Secretary, to clarify that this four days was for discussion, not for voting. Cheryl re-stated the voting procedures and asked members to hold their votes. As we went about trying to sort through the voting procedures, we discovered that the voting procedure, as established by group conscience, doesn't allow for the number of days necessary to complete the discussion. This interlude caused a light flurry of discussion, until Mage, our Chair ended the discussion, informing the group we would pick it up at the point of motion at the April business meeting.

An active discussion revolved a minimum length of membership and discussion about ways we might define active participation. The general consensus on minimum membership seemed to be that it was appropriate to expect a person be a GROW member for at least one year before volunteering for Treasurer. There was no consensus on active participation, but several members supported Annette's suggestion that we expect a volunteer or nominee to have attended t least two (2) business meetings, which would show interest in the group and its business.

DISCUSSION: ITEM 3B to be continued on 1/23/04.
Cheryl T. requested this item for discussion.
B) Treasurer Job Description: Terms
When the treasurer position changes hands each year, the incoming treasurer must open a new dedicated bank account to which she has access in her own community. This includes getting the GROW secretary's signature on a bank card. The outgoing treasurer must close the GROW bank account she opened the previous year, and she must mail all records to the incoming treasurer. With some of the changes our volunteers have found in opening new accounts, and with other difficulties, this transition process has taken as long as two months. We have discussed options in the past, including 1) lengthening the term of treasurer from one year to two years; and 2) looking into the possibility opening an account with a national banking system. Several members voiced support for extending the treasurer position to two years and no one has voiced opposition to a two-year term. Several members have offered other suggestions as well. For example, Cheryl D. would support a two year term, and she also favors looking into some type of permanent checking account for GROW. She offered to look into this type of account. Karen reminded everyone that there are some very restrictive banking procedures in place in this era of Homeland Security. Annette noted that we haven't changed treasurers since we made the decision to "maintain a checking account in the name of the Treasurer, the Secretary, and, if possible, the group. This must be a non-business account used for GROW business only." She wondered if we should just wait and see what, if any, difficulties arise with the next change-over. In response to Karen's statement that having checks made out to GROW sometimes causes her problems, Annette wondered if we should consider making checks out to the treasurer and putting GROW in the "for" line.

IN ANOTHER MATTER, Kris E. noted that only a handful of people take part in the business meeting and asked how many members are on the business list. She expressed concern that perhaps others, like her, are getting to the point of not really caring because of the way we drag things out. The Chair informed her that there were 19 or 20 GROW members signed up on the Business List. There were no other responses.

This completes the minutes for January 19 - 22, 2004.
Cheryl T., Secretary

GROW Business Meeting
MINUTES, JANUARY 23 - 26, 2004
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Mage B., Chair, updated the Agenda for the next 4-day session as follows:
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GROW BUSINESS MEETING AGENDA: Updated January 23, 2004
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3A - TREASURER MINIMUM MEMBERSHIP
Original discussion statement:
The Treasurer holds a key position, as well as much of the responsibility for the online existence and credibility of our group. For the protection of GROW, the individual who handles all member contributions, pays all of our bills and maintains all of our financial records should have a history of at least six months as a member of GROW.

Revised discussion statement for discussion January 23 - 26 The Treasurer holds a key position, as well as much of the responsibility for the online existence and credibility of our group. For the protection of GROW, the individual who handles all member contributions, pays all of our bills and maintains all of our financial records should have a history of at least one year as a member of GROW and one year of active participation such as membership in two business meetings.

3B - TREASURER TERM
When the treasurer position changes hands each year, the incoming treasurer must open a new dedicated bank account to which she has access in her own community. This includes getting the GROW secretary's signature on a bank card. The outgoing treasurer must close the GROW bank account she opened the previous year, and she must mail all records to the incoming treasurer. With some of the changes our volunteers have found in opening new accounts, and with other difficulties, this transition process has taken as long as two months. We have discussed options in the past, including 1) lengthening the term of treasurer from one year to two years; and 2) looking into the possibility opening an account with a national banking system. A committee was going to look into the latter.

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We began this four-day session with one two-part item remaining on the agenda.
3A - Treasurer Minimum Membership
The Chair reported that despite having only two more 4-day sessions, we would have one more 4-day discussion on this agenda item to reflect the views of the list. She stated that at the next 4-day session she will ask for a head nod, If we do not reach consensus in the final four-day session before closing, Agenda Item 3A will be carried over to the April business meeting.

DISCUSSION: The emails for this item are difficult to sort through, because some commented during an earlier discussion, and either changed their decisions this week, or did not respond again. There have been seven (7) respondents, and all seven support a one-uear membership for the treasurer position.

The opinion on the issue of active participation isn't quite so clear, but as best as I can decipher what's happened so far, it appears that three (3) of the seven (7) respondents oppose (or are "uncomfortable with" requiring active participation as a stated guideline. I am including the names here. Please let me know if I missed someone or otherwise haven't recorded this correctly. Those who support one-year membership as a guideline stated in the Treasurer job description: Cheryl T., Cheryl D., Louise, Kris E., Diane N., Jean, Kathi E., Annette made the suggestion regarding attendance at two previous business meetings, but hasn't clearlly stated whether she, personally, is in support of the idea. Cheryl D., Laura B. and Cheryl T. oppose (or are "uncomfortable with")including guidelines regarding active participation.

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3B - Treasurer term
The Chair reported that she had heard nothing from a committee. She asked if one had been formed, and if not, could one be formed. She suggested that three members could canvass local banks and report back their findings to this meeting. She returned later the same day with findings from four (4) banks in her area (that information is listed at the end of these Minutes). Cheryl T. suggested that we discuss extending the service term for Treasurer now, and that we ask a committee to further explore the banking issue and report back to the April business meeting. The objective would be to make a decision one way or another, and if the choice is to change to a permanent bank account, prepare to transition with the new Treasurer in October. Eight (8) respondents support revising the Treasurer job guidelines to reflect a two year term. These eight also appear to suport further exploration of setting up a permanent account with a national bank. Cheryl D., Mage, Cheryl T., have volunteered to research this further and report back in April. If someone is missing from the Minutes, please let me know.

Now follows the information Mage gathered about four banks in her area.

1. US Bank. 24 states, now has 4500 locations. We would have a Business account as an Association Name: GROW We would need confirmation of existence: Letters establishing who we are (examples are) Minutes, Website, Opening account: New signers would need to have a person bring in account papers, signers papers, Letter saying who was elected, Notarized To change signers. Need actual person to contact original branch. New treasurer to contact branch nearest her. Assist Mgr was willing to work with me to open the account.

2. Union Bank. West coast bank. Must have an EID. Employer Tax ID. Unwilling to compromise one twit.

3. Wells Fargo. 23 Western states. Need to create a tax ID to open an account. Category: Business Account: Incorporated Org Association Non-Profit (If we do this, there are other requirements.)

4. Bank of America 22 states plus Fleet Bank in the East. Category: Business Account Ba of A must identify signers (Patriot act) 2 forms of ID for each signer Minutes to prove we are us show we have a change of volunteers IE: new Secretary and Treasurer To open account: One signer bring in signitors OR One signer brings in Bring in Notorized letter saying who new signitors will be with signed signitor cards. Need tax ID. One initiating signer would have to use SS#. To change signators Must have originating branch fax old sig card plus notarized letter of who is new. Olivia Barner, Asst Vice Prez Bank Center Manager, Point Loma Branch Mgr called legal center for advice.

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This completes the minutes for January 23 - 26, 2004. Cheryl T., Secretary

GROW Business Meeting
MINUTES, JANUARY 27 - 30, 2004
_______________________________
Mage B., Chair, updated the Agenda for the next 4-day session as follows:
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GROW BUSINESS MEETING AGENDA: Updated January 27, 2004
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3A As per our discussion during 1/23 thru 1/26/04
The Treasurer holds a key position, as well as much of the responsibility for the online existence and credibility of our group. For the protection of GROW, the individual who handles all member contributions, pays all of our bills and maintains all of our financial records should have a history of at least one year as a member of GROW and one year suggested active participation such as membership in two business meetings. Can we reach a consensus on this item by head nod?

3B) Treasurer Job Description: Terms:
1) lengthening the term of treasurer from one year to two years. Might we reach a consensus on this item by nodding our heads.

3B. This agenda item will be held over to the next Business Meeting while a Committee researches banks.
When the treasurer position changes hands each year, the incoming treasurer must open a new dedicated bank account to which she has access in her own community. This includes getting the GROW secretary's signature on a bank card. The outgoing treasurer must close the GROW bank account she opened the previous year, and she must mail all records to the incoming treasurer. With some of the changes our volunteers have found in opening new accounts, and with other difficulties, this transition process has taken as long as two months. We have discussed options in the past, including and 2) looking into the possibility opening an account with a national banking system. A committee was going to look into the latter.
Cheryl T. has requested that we re-visit this discussion.

On item 3A, (Treasurer Membership) 5 members nodded yes, 2 shook their heads no, and 2 abstained.
On item 3B (Treasurer Term) 9 members nodded yes. This completes the minutes for January 27 - 30, 2004.
Cheryl T., Secretary

GROW Business Meeting
MINUTES, JANUARY 30, 2004

The Chair summarized the meeting as follows:
1. OSC: There is already a web site in place, and that we will wait until OSC arrives at a charter that we can support before voting on their definition of an online group, the OSC rep length of term*, and the GROW listing on their OSC website. We agreed to write a brief statement that could be sent to OSC. Gigi and a number of Biz List members worked on this and it was sent out early. Gigi will keep us apprised of what is happening in OSC.

2. Online Contributions: Chair ended the discussion, informing the group we would pick it up at the point of Motion at the April business meeting.

3A. Treasurer Job Description: We did not reach a consensus on this agenda item, so this will be held over until the next Business Meeting in April.Cheryl T added this comment that must be included in our April discussion of this Agenda Item:
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When I asked for these last two discussions I imagined adding one brief phrase for the suggestion about length of GROW membership, and simply changing 1 year term to 2 year term. I also would like it known that the paragraph that begins "The Treasurer holds a key position..." and ends with "...should have a history . . ." was simply my rational for suggesting these changes. It was never my intent that the whole paragraph become part of the job description. --Cheryl T.
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3A. "The Treasurer holds a key position, as well as much of the responsibility for the online existence and credibility of our group. For the protection of GROW, the individual who handles all member contributions, pays all of our bills and maintains all of our financial records should have a history of at least one year as a member of GROW and one year suggested active participation such as membership in two business meetings."

3B. Treasurer Job Description: Terms: We have reached a consensus on Agenda Item 3B, and the term of Treasurer has been lengthened from one year to two years.
3B. Committee on Banking:
We agreed to form a committee to look into finding one bank that would host our GROW account and be willing to change signatories every two years.Cheryl D,. Cheryl T., Mage, and Jean have offered to be members of this committee. The committee can report back to the list at the April 2004 Business Meeting.
The Chair thanked everyone for taking part in the January 2004 Business Meeting. She noted that her term ends in April 04, and she is now actively looking for a replacement.

The January 2004 Business Meeting was closed.

April

-Quarterly Reports
Thanks to the newest volunteers: Mage B. Back-up Listkeeper; Judi N., Business Meeting Chair; Kris E., Greeter; Cathy K., Greeter; 12-Step Listkeeper, Diane N., 12-Step Listkeeper Back-up, Bronwyn; Birthday Listkeeper, Listkeeper, Laura B.; Josee, Welcomer; Louise, Welcomer

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GROW BUSINESS MEETING AGENDA: April 2004
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Item 1: ONLINE CONTRIBUTIONS
A motion was made and seconded at the January 2004, business meeting.We did not reach consensus and there was a concern that not enough time had been allowed for discussion. Therefore, it has been brought forward as the first item on this quarter's agenda. (The full report will be posted separately).

Item 2: TREASURER JOB DESCRIPTION
Two issues from the January 2004 Agenda (Items 3a and 3b) were tabled to the April business meeting.

2a. TREASURER JOB DESCRIPTION: MINIMUM MEMBERSHIP IN GROW
We discussed establishing a minimum length of membership in GROW for the Treasurer. We did not reach consensus. In addition, Cheryl T. wrote that when she requested the discussion, she did not intend for the background information and rational she provided to become part of the job description. This has been amended in the full. Agenda Item posted separately. (Was Jan. 04, Agenda item 3a)

2b. TREASURER JOB DESCRIPTION: BANKING PROPOSAL
We agreed to ask a committee to research banking options and bring a proposal to the April 2004 business meeting. Cheryl D,. Cheryl T., Mage, and Karen W. volunteered. (Full agenda 2b to be posted separately. Was Jan. 04, Agenda item 3b)

3. ARCHIVIST STORAGE
Jean, our Archivist, requests a discussion on a safe way to archive. (Full agenda item 3 to be posted separately.)

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MINUTES (April 1-4) & AGENDA UPDATE (April 5-8)
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Item 1: ONLINE CONTRIBUTIONS
In January we were unable to reach consensus through discussion on this agenda item. We then initiated the formal voting procedure with a motion, which was then tabled until this meeting.
The motion: GROW will contribute 20% to OIAA and 80% to GSO.Our OIAA Rep will privately let the OIAA Treasurer know that we are reducing our contribution in keeping with our letter of April, 2003.
During the four days allotted, formal discussion was minimal. Those supporting the 20/80 split feel that OIAA needs to evaluate the reasons for the decrease in the number of contributing groups from 15 to 5 over the past 3 years, and that they need to broaden their financial base. Karen said she doesn't consider this a punitive action, "rather it is donating in proportion to all the other groups that benefit from its services just as much as GROW does."
Annette re-stated her opposition to the motion because OIAA is the only service entity for online A.A. She quoted passages from previous GROW discussions confirming the value of OIAA. Annette suggests we should continue our support OIAA until OSC is able to function as an online service entity, and that cutting contributions because of the consistent bickering on the main OIAA list is not placing principles before personalities.
We will now have four days to vote on this motion. I will post the voting notice by separate email.

Item 2a: MINIMUM MEMBERSHIP
In January, we discussed establishing a minimum length of membership in GROW for the Treasurer. At that time we agreed on a one-year membership, but disagreed on additional wording. The item was carried forward from the January business meeting, as we did not reach consensus.
At the start of this meeting, Mage submitted, and Jean seconded, this motion: "The treasurer should have at least six months as a member in grow."
Cheryl T., standing in temporarily as Chair, asked if Mage would be willing to amend the motion to reflect the one year membership that the group had seemingly agreed upon in January. Mage amended the motion as follows: "The treasurer should have at least one year as as a member in grow."
Louise and Diane N. agree with adding the statement to the Treasurer's job description. gigi asked why we need this if Cheryl T. and Karen are to be our Treasurers, and Cheryl D. reminded us that we began discussing the requirements for the treasurer before the banking committee submited a proposal that could impact whatever decision is made. Kris M. suggested we define the treasurer position(s) before we decide.
I am not sure where to go with this and will ask for the group's direction. I will pose the question by separate email.

2b. TREASURER JOB DESCRIPTION: BANKING PROPOSAL
In January we asked for a volunteer committee to research banking options and bring a proposal to this business meeting. Cheryl D,. Cheryl T., Mage, and Karen W. volunteered. Louise, gigi and Annette have expressed concerns about a plan that creates two non-rotating trusted servants. gigi supports the plan overall, and suggested either putting an extended time limit on the the non-rotating positions, or not allowsing the non-rotating TS to have voting power on the Steering Committee. Louise suggested reviewing the issues that led the group to approve a non-rotating co-archivist. Annette reminded us that rotation ensures that all members share in service (per the A.A. Group pamphlet) and argued that the concerns of the banking committee are either immaterial to the current disussion or have been addressed by previous group decisions. She suggested that we hold off making a decision until after the next turnover.
Jean supports the proposal. Karen, Mage, Cheryl D. and Cheryl T. responded to the questions about rotation and other concerns.
Example, Annette A. wrote: "The proposal presented by the Committee said other online groups had been contacted. How were they resolving this problem? What kind of responses did you receive?"
Karen responded that many groups don't have treasurers and they meet on free servers. "One group has a permanent list owner and members occasionally send donations to that person to pay the bill. Another group has permanent bank account owner who forwards the bank statements to rotating treasurers."
Mage spoke to the issue of post 9/11 safety regulations. Cheryl T. pointed out that only 6 of 23 trusted servant positions are currrently available for members with less than one year and suggested that there may be different ways to fullfill the true spirit of rotation.
Seven of the 22 members on this list have participated in this important discussion. We will continue the discussion for the second 4-day session.

3. ARCHIVIST STORAGE
Jean, our Archivist happily reported that Annette had located all of our original documents from the formation of our group. Jean will now be able to re-build our archives. She described her work as Archivist. Several members made suggestions about searchable storage and the need to define a purpose. Cheryl T. posted the group conscience decisions currently in place for the GROW Archives.
Gigi and Annette support the idea of forming a committee to explore the possibilities and costs involved with different archival methods.
We will form a committee to further explore archival methods. A request setting this in motion will be provided by separate email.

4. GSR/OGR JOB DESCRIPTION
gigi has requested that we amend the GSR/OGR job description to include the amount of time necessary for extra e-mail.

In Service, Cheryl T., Secretary
Temporarily standing in as Chair for Judi N.

=====================================
MINUTES: APRIL 5 - 8, 2004
=====================================

Item 1: ONLINE CONTRIBUTIONS
In response to Karen's statement that we are scheduled to donate $102.69 if we continue with the 50/50 split, Annette questioned if we should still be sending the same amount, per group conscience of the 50/50 split when the funds were collected. Karen responded that she didn't know the answer and would defer to the GC. Annette later requested that the question to be put on the agenda.
Voting took place on the motion:
GROW will contribute 20% to OIAA and 80% to GSO. Our OIAA Rep will privately let the OIAA Treasurer know that we are reducing our contribution in keeping with our letter of April, 2003.
These are the numbers recorded:
FOR: 10 AGAINST 2 The motion passed by a majority of 83%.

Item 2a: MINIMUM MEMBERSHIP
Because there were some concerns about trying to decide this before knowing how the position might change with the banking proposal also on the agenda, Cheryl T., filling in for Judi N. as Chair, asked if the group wished to hold off on the issue, or continue on with the formal process. These are the opinions recorded:
HOLD OFF: 10

2b. TREASURER JOB DESCRIPTION: BANKING PROPOSAL
During this 4-day session we heard from several members who had not yet shared opinions. Diane N. likes the idea of a permanent bank account with a one year membership for the person who holds that account. The group treasurer, a rotating treasurer with six months of sobriety, could share responsibilities and records for this account, but not have access to it. Laura B. supports the proposal and would also support making the permanent positions non-voting representatives of the Steering Committee. Kris M. stated that she sees both pros and cons, pro being recognition of the banking difficulties, con being her dedication to the traditions and concepts. Kris also stated that she feels we need more time to discuss the issue adequately.
Annette noted that should we make this change, we would also have to agree to change our "Traditions in Cyberspace," which states, "All trusted servant roles are term limited to allow for rotation of leadership." Cheryl T. responded that we should have changed our guidelines when the permanent Archivist position was established. She will ask to have it put on the agenda for July. Cheryl referred to a second tradition passage in the 12x12 to support a suggestion that we might include the requirement that the account owners be approved for continuation by a vote every two years.
Jean responded that the idea made sense to her and that she would like to apply it to the permanent Archivist position as well. Laura B. said it seemed like a "wise and careful" response in a manner that addresses AA principles and suggested that we consider this action for the archivist position as well. Annette responded that voting to re-elect (or not) would be keeping with the spirit of rotation, but could, in reality, be a vote based on the popularity of the account owners. She intended to say that it would NOT be in the spirit of rotation. She also suggested that the Treasurer and Archivist issues be discussed separately.
Kris M. stated her opinion that the treasurer should rotate, and suggested a 3 year term instead of 2. The treasurer should be allowed to put the account in her own name. Kris wants to see a backup plan in place in the event that a treasurer is unable to do her duties to insure that bills would be paid, perhaps keeping the World bill paid ahead as an insurance against emergency. Kris hopes everyone feels comfortable re-electing the same one or two trusted servants if they are the only willing and able members volunteering at the end of each term.

3. ARCHIVIST STORAGE
Cheryl T., Temporary Chair, called for volunteers to serve on a committee to further explore committee to further explore archival methods. Jean, Louise and Gigi have volunteered.

4. GSR/OGR JOB DESCRIPTION
gigi has requested that the GSR/OGR job description be amended to include the amount of time necessary for extra e-mail. Dawn R. proposed two separate positions. Jean agreed on the basis that there seems to be too much mail for one position to handle.

Please let me know if you find any errors in these minutes, or if you disagree with my translation of what has occured over the past 4 days.

In Service, Cheryl T., Secretary

=====================================
MINUTES: APRIL 9 - 12, 2004
=====================================

1. ONLINE CONTRIBUTIONS
Minority opinion: Annette stated that she is not fully opposing a decrease, but opposes the drastic cut from 50% to 20%. She feels a decrease to 25% is sufficient without seriously jeopardizing the work of OIAA. She followed with quotes from various members who had commented on the good things OIAA does. Minority opinion: Shirley feels that there may be some punitive feeling behind what she also considers too drastic a cut. She stated that even with growing pains associated with online A.A., OIAA does a great job and does want to see it end.
Both have asked for reconsideration of the amount.

2b. TREASURER JOB DESCRIPTION: BANKING PROPOSAL
This issue has generated considerable discussion. In total, 7 members have spoken in support of the proposal; 7 members have spoken against the proposal. Most vocal have been those who disagree with the proposal because of the permanency of the treasurer and back-up. In response to the concerns, Cheryl T. suggested adding the following amendment to the proposal:
"Every (X amount of time) the Chair will call for a vote of confidence, at which time any member can volunteer and/or nominate someone else for the position(s)."
gigi, referring to Tradition 8, remarked that although it doesn't directly deal with rotation as a principle, it does deal with the practicalities of AA work and the need to remain flexible. She suggested adjusting Treasurer requirements to achieve rotation, either by the the vote of confidence/approval every two years; or changing Treasurers every two years, or rotating between two people every term.
Kris M. who opposes the proposal on the basis of the rotation issue suggests choosing NOT to have a GROW bank account, instead allowing the treasurer keep track of funds.
Kris E. and Diane N. agree that we should trust the Treasurer to keep GROW funds in her name with a detailed account monthly sent to the Ass't treasurer and Sect. unless it is required more often.
Louise likes the option of re-electing the same treasurers, but feels more strongly that the principle of rotation be upheld. She agrees that the Treasurer should keep group funds in her personal account, paying bills from that, and keeping a ledger. She suggests a 3-year term and feels rotation will be easier if the accounting is left to the discretion of each autonomous treasurer.
Kate spoke neither for or against the proposal, but disagreed with the co-mingling GROW cash with personal accounts.
Annette again pointed out that we already have Group Conscience decisions removing the contraints on having the checking account in the treasurer's name. However, we do require a dedicated account so that GROW funds are not confused with personal, and to protect the treasurer's personal accounts when copies of statements are sent to the Secretary. She also reminded the group that by GC, Karen had been given permission to ask that checks be made payable to her. Annette suggests that while this was not a permanent decision, we should consider it. She also asked Karen what problems she encountered when she opened the dedicated account.
Karen re-stated the process she had gone through in opening an account, adding that she still asks for contributions in the GROW name as matter of trust for the group. Because the checks are made out to GROW and deposited in an account held in her name, some tellers have refused the deposits.
Kris M. referenced having worked for many large A.A. functions and in many service capacities and said she would not hesitate to write a check out to the GROW treasurer any more than she would hesitate to put cash in a basket passed at a face to face meeting. Kris also reminded everyone that any treasurer wanting to spend group money for personal gain could easily do so, even with the account in GROW's name, and suggested that it is false security to think we are protected from thievery by writing donation checks out to GROW. Kris thinks it is impractical to spend a huge amount of effort and time trying to find complicated ways to "safeguard" a few hundred dollars.
In another email, Kris M. reiterated her belief that the proposal breaks tradition, and that permanent leadership goes beyond healthy autonomy. Kris believes the answer is to amend our banking policy, not to turn away from Tradition.
Annette agrees with Kris M. and suggests that during this business meeting we might change the July 2003 Group Conscience decision to say that checks are made payable to the treasurer, rather than leaving it to the treasurer to ask.
Gigi expressed concern about a group conscience decision of October 2002 requiring that a non-business checking account be in the name of the Treasurer, the Secretary and if possible, the group. She questions how we meet this criteria if the Treasurer and Secretary are in different states, and the expresses concern about both positions being non-rotating. Gigi also posted the following passages from an article in her "Box 4-5-9."

3. ARCHIVIST STORAGE
Judi, Chair, called for at least one more volunteer to serve on a committee to further explore archival methods. There were no other volunteers.

4. GSR/OGR JOB DESCRIPTION
After several members suggested splitting the GSR/OGR job, gigi re-stated that she did not think this was necessary, and re-stated her request that we add a statement to the current job description similar what's written in the Secretary and Chair job descriptions. Cheryl T. suggested that, trusting in gigi's judgment, we keep the job as it is, and add the following statement to the GSR/OGR job description:
Anticipate heavy increase in correspondence, especially during the months when OSC is in session.

5 CURRENT DONATIONS
Karen reported that we are scheduled to donate $102.69 if we continue with the 50/50 split. The following question was put before the group:
Since the funds were collected under the 50/50 split, should we still send the same amount, per group conscience when the funds were collected?"
Of the 7 members who responded to this question, six (Jean, Diane, Kris E. Cheryl T. Cheryl D. and Annette) answered yes. gigi stated she would go with whatever was decided, and asked for help understanding when a change takes place. Does the change take place when we vote? Before the vote do we conform to our previous decision no matter how long we discuss it? Cheryl T. responded that it was her opinion that we follow current group conscience until it changes. In this case, at the end of this 4-day session, or at the end of the next 4-day session, depending on whether or not there is a re-vote.

Please let me know if you find any errors in these minutes, or if you disagree with my translation of what has occured over the past 4 days.
In Service, Cheryl T., Secretary

=====================================
MINUTES: April 13 - 16, 2004
=====================================
Item 1: ONLINE CONTRIBUTIONS
No majority voter requested a re-vote.

2b. TREASURER JOB DESCRIPTION: BANKING PROPOSAL
Kris M. suggested that we could make changes to the Treasurer position based on suggestions made during the proposal discussion: She listed the following examples:
1. We could consider putting our account in the name of the Treasurer instead of in the name of GROW and then....
2. ...we could consider having donation checks made out to the Treasurer instead of to GROW.
3. We could consider having only one signer on the account, the Treasurer. 4. We could consider changing the length of term for the Treasurer.
5. If the Treasurer feels that it would help her to be relieved of the duty. we could add a GROW position of "Basket-Passer".
Gigi hopes we will continue the discussion in our July meeting, as Kris M. suggests, reminding us that the question of the treasurer's minimum membership would be on the next agenda. As an FYI, Gigi also informed the group that OSC is in a state of upheaval and in time we may want to look re-visit our continued participation.
Cheryl T. suggested that, other than the motion, we table the Treasurer/Bank issue for now and look at it again after the next Treasurer has some time in the job. She reminded us that we need to review our Tradition 9, and the archivist and webmaster jobs in relation to our statement that "All trusted servant roles are term limited to allow for rotation of leadership." She also reminded the group that we were overdue for a group inventory and requested that we conduct one in September. Jean agreed.

4. GSR/OGR JOB DESCRIPTION
Thirteen of 13 members agreed with Gigi's request that we amend the GSR/OGR job description to include this statement:
Anticipate heavy increase in correspondence, especially during the months when OSC is in session.

5. CURRENT CONTRIBUTION
Twelve of 13 members agreed that the funds collected under the group conscience of 50/50 split should be sent in the schedled amount of 50/50. One member abstained.

Please let me know if you find any errors in these minutes, or if you disagree with my translation of what has occured over the past 4 days.
In Service, Cheryl T., Secretary

=====================================
MINUTES: April 17 - 20, 2004
=====================================

Item 1: ONLINE CONTRIBUTIONS
The chair reported that, as there were no calls for a re-vote, the motion stands approved as written and will be recorded as a group conscience decision as follows:
GROW will contribute 20% to OIAA and 80% to GSO.
Judi asked Karen, OIAA Representative, to privately let the OIAA Treasurer know that we are reducing our contribution in keeping with our letter of April, 2003?

Item 2a. MINIMUM MEMBERSHIP The chair reported that the motion re: the Treasurer's length of membership with GROW would be carried over to the July 2004 business meeting as Agenda Item #1.

Item #6. NEXT
Everyone who responded to this issue agreed with letting the treasurer/banking issue rest for the time being. Karen requested that volunteers for the treasurer position not wait until the October meeting as it takes some time to set up a new account and to transfer the funds to a new bank. Gigi suggested we post the position in September.
Kris E., responding to the previous request for a group inventory in September, said she would rather not wait until September to do the group inventory, and that she wants to explore what we can do to encourage more participation.
Gigi requested that we discuss our OSC participation in July.
Cheryl T. posted the trusted servant positions that will be open in July and said it isn't too soon to start thinking about who to nominate.
Co-Archivist - Judi (7/03 - 7/04)
Greeter: Jean (7/03 - 7/04)
OIAA - Karen (7/03 - 7/04).; Backup: Nancy (7/03 - 7/04)
Secretary - Cheryl T. (7/03 - 7/04)
Sponsor Listkeeper - Barb S. (1/04 - 7/04)
Weekly Meeting Lead Listkeeper - Kris M. (1/04 - 7/04)

Please let me know if you find any errors in these minutes, or if you disagree with my translation of what has occured over the past 4 days.
Cheryl T., Secretary

July

Business: Because of problems with World, we discontinued our July business meeting after one week. We are reconvening an abbreviated meeting to complete three agenda items. Those dealing with Archives and Rotation have been tabled to the October meeting.

=============================================
GROW BUSINESS MEETING AGENDA: July 2004
=============================================

[1] TREASURER MINIMUM MEMBERSHIP
Motion: "The treasurer should have one year as a member of GROW."

[2] OSC Participation
Continuation of past discussion and confirmation of SC decision

[3] PREPARATION FOR GROUP INVENTORY
-------------------
Please _DO NOT_ respond to this summary. I will post each agenda item by separate email and ask that you respond to each agenda item by separate email with the agenda item clearly identified in the subject line.

=====================================
MINUTES & AGENDA UPDATES
=====================================
July 31 - Aug. 3
The following are minutes for the first 4-day segment of the business meeting:

The meeting opened Saturday, July 31 by Cher, acting Chair for the meeting. Judi needed to step down for personal reasons. The Chair presented our first three agenda items, which were voted on by the meeting attendees.

[1] Vote on Treasurer Minimum Membership
Motion: "The treasurer should have one year as a member of GROW." ~~Passed by unanimous vote of 14 members.

[2] OSC Participation
Our participation for OSC has been an item of discussion, and under consideration since July 2002. In June, Gigi, our OSC Rep asked the Steering Committee (SC) for direction below). After discussing a variety of options, including opening the business list for an emergency meeting, the SC decided that:
"We not send our representatives to the July OSC; and that we take the discussion of permanent withdrawal from OSC to the regular business meeting in July."
~~Passed by unanimous vote of 14 members.

[3] Preparation for group inventory
GROW's first group inventory was held in September, 1999, and (per group conscience 9/98), was to be taken at least every two years thereafter. Our last group inventory was taken in October 2001. It was determined at the last business meeting that we are past due, and we will conduct a Group Inventory in September, 2004. To conduct a group iinventory, our Secretary posts three questions to GROW each week over the course of the month.
The work of this Business Meeting is to decide on the questions that will be asked. There are 12 questions that have been used in the past and 3 questions that were suggested as possible additions.
~~There isn't complete consensus yet on the questions that will be used.
--------------------------------------

Treasurer Report
The Treasurer made a report that included a recommendation of selecting a dollar amount for our prudent reserve, based on realities of banking situations. This issue is being discussed.

Respectfully submitted,
Laura B., GROW secretary

=============================================
GROW BUSINESS MEETING AGENDA UPDATE AUG. 4 - 7
=============================================
[1] MINIMUM MEMBERSHIP

As reported by our Secretary, it will be recorded as group conscience by majority vote and added to the Treasurer Job Guidelines that "The treasurer should have one year as a member of GROW"
[2] OSC Participation
It will be recorded as group conscience by consensus that GROW will no longer participate in OSC.
[3] Preparation for group inventory
This item needs a little more work. I will post this item by separate email for your response.[4] Change from World to Binhost (informational summary - no action necessary)
-------------------
Cheryl T., Chair

Minutes Aug. 4-7 & Meeting Wrap-up
Laura and I are combining the minutes with the final wrap-up, as they are brief, and would most likely be redundant. I'm sure we are not alone in being ready to get on with our summer!
MINUTES Aug. 4 - 7
[3] PREPARATION FOR GROUP INVENTORY
The Chair pointed out that since the original selection of the 12 questions was a matter of group conscience, we would need consensus or majority vote to change those questions. Of those who responded to a request for head nods, all said they could support conducting the inventory in September using the same 12 questions we have used in the past.
[4] CHANGE FROM WORLD TO BINHOST
Our Secretary, as former Listkeeper, and Karen W. as current listkeeper submitted a summary concerning the change from World to Binhost. The summary covers why the change was made, how the decisions were made, and what steps were taken to move from one to the other. See entire report.
PRUDENT RESERVE
This item came as a request for input with the Treasurer's Quarterly Report, and was not listed as an agenda item. With her report, Karen included a recommendation that we increase our prudent reserve in preparation for the upcoming change in Treasurer and GROW bank account. She suggested increasing our prudent reserve to either a round number of $100 or 12 months worth of expenses for $144. Everyone who responded is in agreement that we increase prudent reserve to $100.
CO-ARCHIVIST
Perhaps the best news of all is that Susan G. agreed to accept the Co-Archivist position.

----------------------------------
WRAP-UP
As previously reported, in addition to the items above, in the previous 4-day segment of the "July 04" business meeting we:
1) Decided by majority vote to add one-year GROW membership to the Treasurer Job Description;
and
2) Agreed by consensus that GROW will no longer participate in OSC.
-------------------

WHAT'S NEXT?
Group Inventory:
Per group conscience, we will conduct a group inventory in September. Our Secretary will post three questions to GROW each week over the course of the month. These will be posted in addition to the weekly topic. Members will send their responses to GROW. At the completion of the inventory, our Secretary submit a summary to GROW.

-------------------
NEXT BUSINESS MEETING: OCTOBER 2004
Review Group Inventory
Report from Archive
Archivist Job Description (rotation)
Webmaster Job Description (rotation)
--------------------

The meeting was adjourned August 8, 2004.

October

=============================================
GROW BUSINESS MEETING AGENDA: October 2004
=============================================

Unforutnately, the web archives do not contain all of the information that it's evident that we talked about during these discussions. The lack is noted by the topics.

[1] REVIEW GROUP INVENTORY

[2] REPORT FROM ARCHIVE COMMITTEE

[3] ARCHIVIST ROTATION
Discussion to revisit a group conscience decision that archivist be non-rotating position (requested by Jean).

[4] WEBMASTER ROTATION
Discussion as to whether the web keeper should be a rotating position (requested by Cheryl T).

[5] EVALUATION OF TS POSITIONS
A suggestion that we review our TS positions and consider limiting and/or consolidating some positions (requested by Laura B).

AGENDA UPDATE: October 6, 2004

[1] REVIEW GROUP INVENTORY

This item is now open for discussion. Below is a much abbreviated version of Laura's excellent summaries. I am providing this to trigger our memories. Please let me know if you need me to post each week's summary to GROW-BUSINESS in its entirety.

Question 1. What is the basic purpose of the group?
We had 16 answers. Most stated in one way or another that the basic purpose of the group is to carry the message of AA to women alcoholics who suffer-- inside and outside the rooms. Some added other comments-- pointing out that GROW is available all day, every day. One noted "... the basic purpose of GROW is a great addition but not a substitute for face to face meetings..."

Question 2. What more can the group do to carry the message?
We had 16 answers, which clustered around several themes: keeping it simple, more participation on GROW by more people, and carrying the message in places outside the GROW list.

Question 3. Do new members stick with us, or does the turnover seem excessive?
15 members shared about this question. Most either indicated that they didn't know how the membership numbers fluctuated, or thought that the membership numbers seemed steady, with several mentioning that it seemed like f2f meetings -- some people come and leave quickly; some come and stay; some come, stay for a while, leave, and may (or may not) return.

Question 4. Do we emphasize the importance of sponsorship? How effectively? How can we do better?
There were 13 responses to the questions for Week 2. The responses tended to indicate that people like the fact that peopletalk about their sponsors or sponsories when sharing experience, strength, and hope. They are glad we have a sponsor list we make available. There was some feeling that we might make the list available immediately for newcomers, and that we could emphasize the importance of sponsorship more.

Question 5. Are we careful to preserve the anonymity of our group members and other A.A.'s outside the meeting rooms? Do we leave the confidences they share at meetings behind?
The consensus was that it is difficult to tell about this one. People tended to reflect on their own practice.

Question 6. Do we take the time to explain to all members the value to the group of following our guidelines of e-mail etiquette? As a member, am I familiar with and do I follow these guidelines?
The consensus was that we seem to do this well.

Question 7. Are all members given the opportunity to speak at meetings and to participate in other group activities?
The consensus is that, yes, everyone can speak at meetings and participate in other activities. "Everyone is given the same opportunity to share at meetings and to participate in group activities. GROW is a very open and inclusive group."

Question 8. Are we mindful that holding office is a great responsibility not to be viewed as the outcome of a popularity contest, are we choosing our officers with care?
This question had a wide-ranging variety of opinions. There did seem to be consensus about part of the question -- do people take the office-holding seriously, do they remember that it is "a great responsibility", as summed up by the following quote:
"Yes, I think the members who hold trusted servant positions are mindful of the responsibility, and I'm confident that we all understand it's not a popularity contest."
However, there was a difference of opinion about an aspect of the question -- choice. Some expressed the belief that people volunteer as they can:
"Sisters volunteer for service when they are able to do so and chosen with care."
Some spoke to the work the group does to encourage service work: "We work hard to motivate and encourage new volunteers and our process allows plenty of time and opportunity for members to step forward."
"The business list walks a razor's edge in stressing the esponsibility and soliciting new members to hold office. The descriptions for the various TS positions look intimidating at first glance and it could be stressed more that each TS position can be mentored for as long as a new officer needs."
Some expressed frustration that many of the same people volunteer frequently because of a perceived lack of interest in service: "The problem is, we can't select! We don't "choose" because it's pretty much the same group of folks who volunteer, over and over, to do the service jobs."

Question 9. Does the group do its fair share toward participating in the purpose of A.A. - as it relates to our "Three Legacies" of Recovery, Unity and Service?
This question also did not have a consensus answer:
"I've been surprised at the "no" answers and suspect I read this question differently. Perhaps individual members don't do a fair share of of one of the three, service in particular, but the group would not have survived this long if the AA purpose wasn't being met. Recovery is the focus of the group. We have Unity in the common purpose and I interpret Service as that done outside of our group."
"No. I think where we are weak in one area, we are, to an extent, weak in all. We need more involvement in business meetings, and more new names on the trusted servant roster."
"The group as a whole does an excellent job of following the three legacies, but I feel there could be more sharing of "esh" on an individual level"
"We cover the Recovery part well, but there is one area I'd like to see a little more, and that is the monthly Step and Tradition part of our meetings....As for Unity, in my opinion, GROW adheres to AA's 12 Traditions quite well. As for Service, I encourage anyone and everyone in this group to step up to service positions when they are offered." "Well, I guess I would say, NO. It doesn't! I don't see service being a focus of the group, except for the efforts of a few people. Which means recovery isn't as much a focus as I'd like."

Question 10. As a group, do we remain informed about AA as a whole? Do we support, in every way we can AA as a whole or just the parts we understand and approve of?
The consensus is that we do stay informed.
"Yes. The GSR and OIAA reps make regular reports. Our support of organizations that represent AA in anyway have been given very careful consideration by the business meeting. Withdrawal or refusal of support has been made based on an organization's non-adherence to the principles or traditions of AA."
"As individual members we are only as informed as we choose to be. I think our group representatives do a great job of making information available. Over the past year or two, members who attend GROW business meetings have worked hard (and in some cases really struggled) to find group conscience on issues related to A.A. beyond our group."

Question 11. Are we considerate of all our members?
The consensus is that we are considerate.

Question 12. As a group, have we done a thorough and fearless inventory, or have we missed an important element?
This question had a mixed answer. Some thought that we did. Others questioned the "thorough" part as at most only 16 people shared out of about 120 members.
"we have done a good inventory... I think that we need to stress service to our group as a whole and hopefully more of our people will join our business meetings."
"The questions have been thorough and I've found the discussion to be fearless. Unfortunately the group's participation has not been thorough. There are many voices here that have not been heard and I am at a loss as to how to get them to contribute their valuable input." "I think we have done an excellent job"
"I think that we have done as thorough and fearless an inventory as it's possible to do with an average of 14 out of approximately 120 members actually responding. I would really be interested in hearing from some of the 80-plus members who haven't spoken up."
"I think the questions are thorough and fearless. It's a mystery to me that only a fraction of members actually participates, and that is the only important element that I can see missing."

A. Archives Backup

Our original members were Jean (Archivist), Gigi and Louise. We began this committee in order to find a way to preserve our archives in another format, in addition to being backed up on hard drive and saved to CD-R.

Jean, our Archivist, wrote to the Grapevine 4 June 2004, but to date has had no response.

When GROW found a new server, Binhost, this committee was asked to consider the archives available through this service. The qualities of an online searchable database appear to be met within the default parameters of Binhosts archive properties. The archives are searchable by date, topic, author and thread of conversation; they are password protected as well. Other hosting services were quite expensive and / or offered no technical support, essential to our members. We are offered up to 20 MB of storage before another pricing scheme needs to be looked at; that is adequate for our needs at present.

Another challenge posed to us was when Timi signed on as our co-archivist in early July. She felt that the way GROW keeps our archives was not correct. Archiving shares was questioned, even though approved by GROW in past business meetings. (Shares are not posted on our web site; any item that is posted is stripped of all identifiers, and the usual standard of first name, last initial is used.) By Julys end, Timi had to resign as co-archivist, due to her health considerations and time constraints.

Susan joined us as co-archivist 14 August. Louise had to leave due to time constraints at the end of August. Our membership now consists of Jean, Gigi and Susan.

On 25 August, Cher (Secretary) sent a detailed message, giving background for our Archives discussion, to have been discussed in our July biz meeting.

It is the suggestion of this committee that all of the pertinent GC decisions, as detailed below from Chers message, be available on our web site, via a link on our Archives page.

Respectfully submitted, Archives Committee

B. Archives Website
Lost from website

C. Archives Content
Lost from website

[3] ARCHIVIST ROTATION
Lost from website

[4] WEBMASTER ROTATION
Lost from website

[5] EVALUATION OF TS POSITIONS
Lost from website

AGENDA UPDATE: October 10, 2004

[1] REVIEW GROUP INVENTORY
Since there has been no further discussion generated by this agenda item, we will consider the item closed.

[2] ARCHIVE REPORT

A. Archives Backup
Lost from website

B. Archives Website
We have consensus that we should continue posting some archives on the GROW website as outlined in our group conscience of April 2000. As no one spoke out against it, a link to the Binhost site will be placed on the Archives pages of www.g-r-o-w.com.

C. Archives Content
We have consensus that our archives are appropriate and in keeping with Traditions.

[3] ARCHIVIST ROTATION
A. We have consensus that the Archivist position should remain non-rotating.
B. Archivist title
Lost from website
C. Dismissal Vote
Lost from website
D. Archivist Job Description (on hold until resolution of 2A)

[4] WEBKEEPER ROTATION -
Lost from website

[5] EVALUATION OF TS POSITIONS
Lost from website

[6] GROW CHECKING ACCOUNT
Lost from website

AGENDA UPDATE: October 14, 2004
[2A] Archives Backup - Consensus
Question: Lost from website
[2B] Archivist title
No motion made - Discussion closed
[3C] Dismissal Vote
No motion made - Discussion closed
[4] Webkeeper Rotation - Consensus
Lost from website
[5] Review of TS Positions
Continued discussion - Lost from website
[6] Grow Checking Account
Question: Lost from website
[7] EXPENSES REIMBURSEMENT
New discussion item - Lost from website
[8] FOUNDERS' CORRESPONDENCE
New discussion item - Lost from website

Treasurer's Reports

Group Inventories
* Archived inventories

GROW

Grateful Recovering Online Women